Episode #35 Dave Linton
Empowering the underdog: Exploring Dignity and Self-worth in Creating Change for Children in Care
In this episode of the Excitable Soul Podcast, I spoke with the extraordinary Dave Linton, an innovator, social entrepreneur, and the founder and managing director of the award-winning company, Madlug.
From humble beginnings as a youth worker, Dave has grown into a passionate advocate for social enterprises.
This conversation unravels Dave's personal journey, shaped by profound early life experiences and a mission to infuse dignity and purpose into the lives of vulnerable children.
Discover how a simple black bin bag sparked a movement of love and value through Madlug, and learn about Dave's inspiring vision to make a lasting impact by connecting socially conscious communities.
If you are seeking a jolt of inspiration and purpose, this episode promises a heartfelt exploration of resilience, significance, and the endless pursuit of meaningful change.
Join us as we uncover the powerful story of Dave Linton and his unwavering determination to make a difference in the world.
Links in the episode:
Read the transcript here
James Glover [00:00:09]:
Alrighty. Welcome to the Excitable Soul podcast. Here, we are interested in all things purpose. We want to know where and how people find meaning and connection in their lives. In every episode, we're gonna be hearing the real life stories of how people have uncovered, understood, and unleashed their own unique sense of purpose. Our hope is that we can all learn from the stories and the journeys of our guests so that we can better find the sense of purpose in our own lives. I'm host James Glover, performance coach and purpose nerd. I'm incredibly excited to be exploring these stories with you.
James Glover [00:00:44]:
So let's get going, shall we? Hello, everybody. Today, we have Dave Linton with us. Dave is an innovator, social entrepreneur, motivational speaker, and the founder and managing director of multi award winning Mad Luck, which achieved b corp certification in 2022. Prior to beginning his journey with Mad Luck, Dave was a youth worker for over twenty years. For the past eight years, he's also become heavily involved in mentoring and raising awareness of social enterprises and social business. Following a hugely successful crowdfunding campaign with Madlog over the summer of twenty seventeen, in 2019, Dave went on to become and win the prestigious title of GBEA entrepreneur of the year for Northern Ireland and entrepreneur for good for The UK. In 2024, he became Randall Foundation entrepreneur of the year for Northern Ireland. Dave is extremely passionate about using Madlog to influence a new younger generation of social entrepreneurs.
James Glover [00:01:44]:
His journey and his work is incredible, and I found this conversation really emotive. I hope you do too. Enjoy. Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, to the Excitable Soul Podcast. I mean, I'm massively excited today. What else would I be? But we have Dave with us, and, we've just had five minutes kind of preamble before we press record, and the kind of the energy level just seems to have ramped up. So, if you're kind of coming from a calm place into this conversation, sorry, but kinda not sorry. We'll hopefully kind of guide you and adjust you in.
James Glover [00:02:17]:
But, Dave, welcome. How are you feeling today?
Dave Linton [00:02:19]:
Yeah. Good. Thanks, James. So it's really, really good to to be on this podcast and to to spend this little bit of time exploring together and being excitable together in many ways.
James Glover [00:02:29]:
We were we were just kind of chatting about, both being dyslexic, where we read, what we don't read, kind of the the fact that actually just kind of being in the moment and kind of going for it is is preference on both sides. So I guess we probably need to tee up the audience. We have no real clue where this conversation is gonna go, but but we're both in it. Mega. So one of the things that that would be really wonderful, Dave, is, you know, the the whole principle of the Excitable Soul podcast is about meaning. It's about purpose. It's about understanding what's kind of really shaped, how somebody shows up in the world. What are the kind of the experiences or the people that has helped them find kind of importance and significance? And I'm wondering if we can just start there in your journey, really.
James Glover [00:03:15]:
What have been some of the moments that have really shaped who you are in the world? Yeah.
Dave Linton [00:03:18]:
I'm gonna go deep right at the start here, Sean. So it's, so for me, the whole the whole key shaping was at five. I lost my dad, and my, Alan and my my mom didn't work. It was those days when one one person had all the money. There was or they don't raise all the money, and, there was no insurances, stuff like that. So in many ways, I I lived on the edge of care. And, but when I look back, this was key moments for me because for for for me, the I I watched a mom who, had resilience, who modeled something of care, who went out and got a job, who, learned how to drive, who, just took it on. And and then I was a surround she was surrounded by significant friends and families.
Dave Linton [00:04:11]:
People some people weren't even blood relations. And so, you know, the reason I stayed out of a care a care system was actually because of the significant battles, you know, guy, neighbors who were, like, two or three years older than I was, and they were, taking me windsurfing with them, taking me playing football to football matches. They took us on holidays, my sister and I, and and there was just this level of significant adult. So that it was that significant adult. Also, what had happened was I was in this, this place where my mom stepped in. The resilience that she had, she was the most caring person that that that I ever knew. And, and that led to something that she modeled in my life to give me a sense of caring for people being significant model to other people because of people around and that that's kind of, and I was interviewed in a recent podcast, or leadership thing. And they said, who's the most significant person in your life.
Dave Linton [00:05:09]:
And I was like, my mom was just, it was just this moment of, just modeling. She, she went on and she did a bit of house, home help stuff to just raise money. And somebody believed in her and said there's a job offered for an an auxiliary nurse. She got an auxiliary nurse job. And when she retired at 65, she retired full time as a a as a conduit to Eunice and the union, and I'm not a union person at all. But I, but, actually, what I modeled from her and her whole journey was she stood up, and I watched her on phone calls. I watched her, pastorally caring for people. I watched her complaining to people in, in, the directors and managers.
Dave Linton [00:05:58]:
And this, this woman who had no job when my dad died was confident. She was actually in London. The data bombs went all off in this. And she's so this, this woman was traveling, making a difference and, and, and just modeled. And I came home some nights to be honest. And she at our dinner table, when I was an adult and I was working, I was coming, coming home. There was a woman, there was people sitting at our dinner tables who were alcoholics, who she had stood and fought for their, their, their, their jobs to be kept. And she thought, well, I'll distract them and give them friendship.
Dave Linton [00:06:32]:
And so when I look back, I mean, I could I can give you all these people that have influential, but actually, it's the the person I was around, the person who the most the stuff that I caught from my mom is just not gives me this excitement and purpose today? And then, you know, those significant family members and and so forth. So that's that's a key part to me.
James Glover [00:06:53]:
I mean, Dave, you didn't just go deep there. You went deep and, like, broad in in one hit, like, the the kind of the the significant moment around your dad passing, but then also the significant person in your mom. But you talked about community. You talked about role modeling. You talked about belief. You talked about, you know, the the kind of the kitchen table and the sick so there's so many things here already. I just wanna unpack if that if that's okay because, and and I guess maybe it's not even in the right order, but there's something really powerful about the kitchen table, and there's something really powerful about the kind of the the community that is created around the kitchen table. Like, in our in our family, the kitchen table has always been the central hub of family activity.
James Glover [00:07:38]:
It's like where we're you know, when you come together and you sit and eat my dad used to work away a lot when we were little, but he was always home on Sunday. He was always home for Sunday lunch, so so we would always be sat around the table together at on Sunday lunch. And even now, like, the moments of when I when I feel a bit lost or when I feel a bit, like, wobbly, I go home to my mom and dad's, and I sit around the kitchen table and have a cup of tea. And and often, there is somebody I don't know sat around the kitchen table at my mom and dad's house because they kind of absorb people in, and people will come and and be part of that. So what was that kind of that kitchen table experience like for you? Having these people who, you know, if you are regardless of where, I guess, where you are in terms of age, you know, having people that you don't know in your house, having people that you don't know in your house who are maybe struggling with things. You know, there'll be a lot of people out there listening. They're like, what? You kind of invite the alcoholics into the house, and do you have children? What is that all about? So can you just kinda break down that experience for us and what that felt like?
Dave Linton [00:08:36]:
It it felt very normal for for me in in in the sense of, you know and, like, it came from a place of, you know, I was the stranger, not pure stranger, but I was the non family member instead of the many other kitchen tables. And so so it was very much a sense of, you know, it was a days when you could go in everyone knew each other and stuff. So we were living in an area where where, we were living in an area that the house was quite nice, but it was it was poverty. So we couldn't have what the others had in our community. You know, it was like windows couldn't be changed. So the drafts were coming through that the the the furniture and it was a bit, worn and outdated compared to some of the people next door. But but there was a sense of everyone just was was kind of you could go and knock the door. Some of them, you could go in and just hi.
Dave Linton [00:09:26]:
And some of them you called your aunt and uncles, so that no blood relationship at all. And, and, you know, and that was very normal. So then whenever you would come home, there was just something of and it wasn't regular, but it was it was deep. So it wasn't just people calling by in a house of hospitality, you know, where, strangers just knocked the doors. It was it was an intentionality with the with the table. It was like, mom had this this lady who five times should have been fired. Probably if she was my employer, she probably I would have been a a frustrated employer. There's no doubt about it.
Dave Linton [00:10:02]:
And, and yet she, you know, she saw that she this person needed a friend, a distraction, and so it was deep. It wasn't just open. It was deep and and infested. And and often, most of the time, I witnessed where it backfired, but she kept getting back up and loving the next person and the next person and the next person. And, and it was for seasons, and it was and that that that that was it. To the point where even growing up as a young person, I had a a house where I could always bring a friend back. And it was it was never the living my life outside of the house. I you know, there was accommodation in the sense of there I could arrive with any friend, and, and they were engaged.
Dave Linton [00:10:54]:
And and and my mom wasn't a nurturing type. I'm not a nurturing type. It was just very much preferred practical. But it was one of, you know, looking at the underdog. And I think my mom's background well, she came from a a family. She was oldest of 14. So she she, from the start, had no education because she had to look after the siblings. The the you know, that was her her kind of, kind of space.
Dave Linton [00:11:17]:
So I think that just caring practicality need, you know, was something there. And it just it just became, very, very natural, James.
James Glover [00:11:26]:
I there's such a a a powerful and wonderful distinction between this isn't just open hospitality. This is deep investment. You know, the the kind of the the significance of of that and the difference of that. And and actually, surprisingly to me, you're saying she's not really the nurturing kite. It wasn't about just nurturing people. It was kind of seeing a need in them and pragmatically being able to meet that need and and, you know, feeling good. What was it do you think that created this level of, of kind of bounce back ability? I, like, I almost don't wanna use the word resilience because it doesn't feel like it's it's it's enough or appropriate enough. But the fact that, you know, maybe some people did take advantage of that, but that was okay because there was gonna be somebody else.
James Glover [00:12:09]:
Like, the fact that she wasn't ever burned by that, it was where's the next opportunity. Where do you think that came from?
Dave Linton [00:12:14]:
I I think it just came from the, you know, probably her upbringing, large family. But I also I also think that the key part to being able to do it was she she was able to have really good support friends. Those those neighbors were were were in it. They they she didn't get to choose them as friends. They chose to be her friend. And so whenever it was tough, whenever it was they were always there. And so she had a really good she was really strong at building relationships and connections. So, that that strength was so it was never that she was just supporting these people on her own.
Dave Linton [00:12:55]:
So she had other she had support, friendships, real friends, and and a strength. And I think that's what, what I think kept her to be able whenever to to see reason in it, to be able to. And, and and when you're not the nurturing type, you you sometimes then become a lot more practical so you can you can move on quicker. It's whenever you let your own kind of, like, fluffy feelings, I suppose, in many ways get. That's when every you you can't get out of that. But if you're not that you know, some people are they're positioning us. There's their personality types. I know that's who I am.
Dave Linton [00:13:37]:
You know, it's like, I I'll I'll go go get let down, and I can you know, I've rarely have an in fact, I rarely have an enemy because it's no matter what somebody has done, I always bounce back and try and see the the good in it, but learn from it.
James Glover [00:13:52]:
Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. And I and I wanted to ask, actually, I wanted to just kinda start to pivot into, the kind of the way in which that role modeling and the way in which that that experience really started to live in you. So, you know, you talked about being five years old when your dad passed. That's that's pretty young, but a pretty informative stage of of life. Like, I'm thinking about my my little boy right now who is five and what that might be like for for him. And, and you you talked about being on the edge of care.
James Glover [00:14:23]:
So what were some of those experiences, like like, how did that how did all of this rest wrestle and all this kind of what was the impact that it had on on you and the kind of the experiences that you that you, had?
Dave Linton [00:14:34]:
I didn't really think anything abnormal about it. I told you now when I look into it, I was on the edge of care. We had a social worker. My mom had a social worker. In those days, we had lots of experiences because of social workers because, you know, in those days, widows and poverty, there was social workers. Now there's not enough social workers to do those jobs, but and so you're kinda left. And and now it would be most people would have some insurances around, so there would wealth would be a you know, you wouldn't be left in poverty the same. People who have learned about that.
Dave Linton [00:15:07]:
And, but, I mean, I can remember just, you know, I can remember the the kind of, you know, things like windows and those things and, just wind blowing through them at night and curtains go on and and stuff. I remembered when everyone else had video recorders, video players, you know, VHS. And, you know, I have the we had for about three years and get a second half one for Christmas. You know, there was those kind of things that that you you just you know, you were different from your friends. And but but there was other benefits, like, the social workers would have arranged for us to be on a holiday. So I got to do kayaking, and I used to think it was a holiday family holiday. It was all funded, and it was activity based. And, you know, I used to think, this is great.
Dave Linton [00:15:57]:
You know, my friends aren't getting this. You know? So it was it was stuff like that that I feel that, and it it just felt normal. It just felt the way it was. There was things I as a young boy, I missed out on. There was things like I I missed the the the father to to do sports with. I missed the the the going to the football matches with my dad and talking. It's I got taken to football matches by neighbors, but I didn't get the to sit at home and talk about football or to to to to have a bit of, you know, that energy. It was it was always, you know, I wanted to go play tennis.
Dave Linton [00:16:35]:
And, and I used to that was probably my biggest, if I'm being honest, the the biggest challenge that I I ended up, and I just before I was married, by 30, I chose to go and do some counseling around this stuff. And, you know, because you the people some of the significant people around you, you you know, you sometimes and they're and they're willing to help, sometimes felt controlled and, you know, and you have all of that stuff, and you you kinda grow resentment to all that stuff. And and then the times I find this, I but actually, I was able to it was just this light switch. I was able to say, these people care. And and, actually, the the perspective I got is that there was lots and lots of people who had dads that didn't get to go to football, that they were observing in the house unhealthy relationships. They weren't catching the stuff. It's only in an adult I look into, and I go, that's why my mom's a hero. But but, actually, at the time you're growing up, you you're an angry young boy at times because you felt the the the loss, the trauma of that loss.
Dave Linton [00:17:43]:
Yeah. And you think everyone's got perfect, and you're different. And and, actually, some ways, I have a really positive. I don't have, I didn't see things that some people are unfortunately seeing today in families. And and, and that was a a really so that was my kind of growing up in care. It was more in the poverty, but it was significant people. That if they hadn't have been around, I could have ended up in care.
James Glover [00:18:07]:
Yeah. Yeah. Amazing. And so can we can we just pivot and kind of fast forward a little bit into the into the kind of the the more the here here and now, and how all of those experiences have have shaped the impact that you're trying to create in the world. Can you just can you just talk us a little bit about, you know, the that that kind of that gap that that and and the work that you're doing now?
Dave Linton [00:18:31]:
Yeah. So, I've when I was 18, I was always in that place where because of it, I was always positioned more to care for people. So I I initially tried to to train as an an architectural technician when I left school with no qualifications. I talked my way into interviews and got jobs and stuff like that. And, and then a building recession hit, and they made the training post redundant. And, so I lost my training post on my job and chose then kind of yeah. Probably was and looking back, it was a bit of a just throw a title in, and probably because of this the lack of the support, you know, the the the push into career building. You know, we were there was kind of, like, a level of you you weren't expected to do anything more than a basic job.
Dave Linton [00:19:21]:
I was there there was no pressure to be anything more than that on me at all. And, so I threw a towel in and, had a little period of of unemployment. And in that unemployment, somebody says there's a little bit of money that you can get on your unemployment to go into a training program way back, like, you know, years and years ago. So you're a teen, and there was a community youth project. And I I went to and I took the 10 pounds on my my dual, and I, and I started going along there. Then there was a part time job, came at the second year of that. And I just filled my boots with, doing, you know, kind of courses around youth work and so forth. And that took me on a journey where I spent then twenty two years as a youth worker and still never being qualified as youth worker.
Dave Linton [00:20:10]:
I had I I I it's it's one of those things that, you know, it was the days when you could do it. I I had, you know, equivalents of, you know, a levels. The youth work wasn't a degree profession in those days. And then when you become experienced at it then, you know, there was jobs I couldn't apply for, but I could apply for enough to have a career in it. So it was you know, because the experience carried it. And, and in that journey, my first youth work job was in the heart of Belfast in the most rundown, toughest communities. And I worked alongside a guy who had spent time, and, and he modeled something of connecting with the most challenging, young people that, you know, you could in the in that time, that community. And something connected with me is to always just love working at the edge.
Dave Linton [00:21:00]:
The the young people who are the ones that most people want to to, you know, spend for a few weeks and put them out and always shout at them and stuff like that. And I grew the biggest love and heart for that kind of young person. And, and I remember growing up always having this feeling of as I was doing that, I was also feeling like someday if I get you know, when I get married, you know, adoption, fostering is gonna be something I wanna children and care. It was just always something. I didn't really know. I just knew foster children. I thought, yeah. We could foster.
Dave Linton [00:21:32]:
We could. And, that was that was it. So I met my wife. She was, my wife, Judith, she was doing respite or short break foster care. And, as a single single girl, she had just her placement had just finished. And, but we kinda connected in that that space. And then when we got married, I went through and got the, the processes to become a foster carer. And then when we had our first, foster placement, a little girl, Deit, who came once a once a, a weekend every month.
Dave Linton [00:22:12]:
And that young girl, basically, is 30 with three kids under the age of 11, no partners around, is at our table for Christmas dinner with all of our family and is, like, part of our family. So, we never fostered any more than that one. Then my my my wife and I, we always said we would no matter if we had birth children, we would adopt. So we adopted our, our oldest daughter and, thinking that we wouldn't have any children and, after trying for a while. And, actually, what she came to us when she was 18. She's now 20. She's thriving. And, and within within a few yeah.
Dave Linton [00:22:58]:
When my wife left work to go on adoption leave, she she she felt unwell, and she didn't find out she was pregnant. So so we we adopted our daughter in the the the September. She came to live with us. And, we had a birth child in, April. So we have two children, and there's there's, you know, ten months or two years between them, which is, like, the perfect leads type thing. Yeah. Yeah. And, that That's that's all
James Glover [00:23:21]:
it ready made family. Boom.
Dave Linton [00:23:23]:
Ready. Yeah. We went you know? And I have to be honest, like, you know, you get in that mood. You don't wanna lose the you've gone through all this adoption process. You don't wanna lose the child that you've fallen in love with through pictures, through all that stuff. And then you're thinking, like, they're gonna stop that because it's, you know, we've got I'm not pregnant. And, and a member of this worker go on to have never experienced anything like this before. And I went, I can you do it? And I went, oh, yeah.
Dave Linton [00:23:49]:
No problem. We're we're we're okay.
James Glover [00:23:51]:
We're okay. Yeah. Yeah.
Dave Linton [00:23:52]:
And, with you at night, it's tough. It was tough. And, you know, it's like you went from from none to two straight away. And and I know you got the people who have twins and stuff, and, but they're at the same stage. You know? It was like, you know, you've got terrible twos on landing, and you've got or teachable twos, I like to say. And then you've got
James Glover [00:24:13]:
At at at, like, 18, two years, they're just at the kamikaze age. Right? Which is, like, no fear, want to be everywhere, totally finding their own mind. So you've got all that flying around at the same time as you've got something that can't can't exist by itself.
Dave Linton [00:24:26]:
And and you have the to do the first child first child, you've got a thing where you've never done it before. So you're even more protective. You're more worried. You're more cautious. Like, make sure that looks right. Make sure that he didn't make sure that video camera, all that stuff, you become more anxious. And then second, third, from what they tell me, it's like, you know, it's it's, you can get through it and and stuff. So we we would do it all of that in the in the time.
Dave Linton [00:24:48]:
And, but we I suppose it's the same way as I got into architectural technician is it was just percent of the great confidence that we can do it. No problem. And then it's and then it was just the the the the reality. So that's where it helps. So then, part of my job, I I as a youth worker or as a director of a a youth project and and my team. And they wanted me to live in the community, and they provided me with a house to live close to the the thing. I was bigger than we could afford. So we rented our own house.
Dave Linton [00:25:22]:
We only lived in this house, moved moved out. And my wife says, we could foster again. We could do more fostering. But because we had had a break, the girl we had had was still really connected. We were committed. We were part of our family. So we didn't we lost the kind of being approved foster care, and then we had moved into a new area. And it sent us back to the back to the start to do the training again, and it was really, really boring if I'm being honest.
Dave Linton [00:25:54]:
It was like, tick box, you have to do it, and we'll just do it. And, what made it even more boring was the level of quality of how it was delivered. You know, I call it ping pong, but it's training, you know, it's like social worker reads the line, the next social worker reads the line, and then the next don't go back. It's like, it's like, I'm not gonna you're centered now playing table tennis. You know? This this PowerPoint by by death. But, the week four was just how do I get to the you know, it's just here. We're we're we're seeing the end of this. This is gonna this is this is the the reality, and it was all about kids moving.
Dave Linton [00:26:31]:
And they showed a video of a young girl, and she was in a wheelchair, a teenager, probably about 15 years of age. And she made this statement. When we move, the local authorities, the local trust, don't give us suitcases. Sometimes foster cares will loan us a suitcase, but quite often our belongings are moved in black plastic, then buys lose our dignity. And I have to be honest with you, James. I heard nothing else, and I I just couldn't get out the wrongness of that. And I left in my head saying, I'm gonna fix that. And never did I think I was gonna fix it by setting up a bag brand that was held across The UK and beyond and and the breadth of it and and having a team doing it and stuff.
Dave Linton [00:27:16]:
I just thought it was simply going back and getting my youth center, the young people there. Every you know, would come in. They had their old school bags that they probably changed every year. I just collect them. They were probably like us. They probably got a few suitcases in the in the attic that, you know, the chains that went to the t k maxes and bought a new bag and and and left the old one, and we could collect it. And it was at that moment I started researching, and I couldn't get past the numbers of children and young people in care. Because I was in this local, I was saying it's children in my own area.
Dave Linton [00:27:49]:
I didn't really think of the bigger story of children in care. And I found that that stage, and this was 2014, there was 93,000 children in care across The UK and Ireland, and it's now about a 7,000. So it's it's on the increase. But at 93,000 and what I what I also found out was that one child entered the care system every fifteen minutes. So even in the the hour of this this chat that we're having, you know, that's four children will have entered care, and most of their belongs in bin bags are today's bin bag is often the plastic shopping bag. So I just thought, well, if I collect from my young people, I'm not going to be able to fix that number. I might be able to help my local community of four or 500 children, but, I needed a bigger solution. And then I couldn't also get past the fact that these children have huge value, huge worth.
Dave Linton [00:28:50]:
In fact, they breathe. They've got value and worth. So and they're not defined by where they come from, what their family background, what they have done, where they have been. They're defined by just the fact they are human. They they they breathe, and that they have huge value and worth. And out of that, they deserve to be treated with dignity. And so dignity has give for me, has given them a proper brand new bag. So that led onto a journey of, okay, if that is what we need the numbers, and we need to try and think not secondhand, I would have solved the bin bag, but it wasn't gonna reinforce the value in worth.
Dave Linton [00:29:34]:
How do I get the resource to be able to take and get enough bags to deal with those 30 plus thousand children moving into care every year, never mind within it and leaving it. And, that's where that's where the whole Madeluk concept came from. I tried the charity. I thought the charity approach, but to be honest, my dyslexia and youth work was I was always innovative at finding ways of doing youth work without having to do a funding application.
James Glover [00:30:03]:
Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So Finding a different solution. Right?
Dave Linton [00:30:06]:
Solution to the problem. Because I hear that funding applications, I I I couldn't get ahead into it. I couldn't get creative with it. I couldn't get all the stuff that was inside to say about stuff. I hear that it took me forever. And and I also hear that the the reporting afterwards, And, you know, and then it's the the other part I didn't really like was whenever you did it, you had people with suits coming in with clipboards doing follow-up reporting and checking in that you spent your money. Right? And I was like, I I I just didn't work with me, and I knew that wasn't fitting who I was as a person. You know, it was never gonna be that that kind of that was never my strong point.
Dave Linton [00:30:49]:
And, and I knew if in a charity world, if I couldn't do that, then I would have to be innovative in doing other things. And the innovation in the other things would be I would have to climb a few mountains, run a few marathons. And to be honest, I you know, I'm trying to be healthier and trying to be a leader that's healthier. But in those days, I had the youth worker belly, and I love my coffee and my wee bun and Starbucks. I ring with work in a coffee shop type thing, but when you weren't working with young people. And, and that was never me either, you know, fundraising and all of that. So that's so I rolled the charity out. And at that moment, I had been reminded of a core a a conference that I attended.
Dave Linton [00:31:33]:
Now it was an American conference, and I went to the satellite site in in Belfast. So it's and they interviewed at that conference a guy called Blake Mikoski, who had founded a brand called TOMS Shoes. That was four years before the black beanbag story came. It was just because what I what I learned is in my I have learned to be, I love leadership. I love learning. I love, development of who Dave is and how to be a better person and a better leader in in the world that I live in. And I have I I just absorbed that. I love vision and strategy and thinking, organizational.
Dave Linton [00:32:14]:
There's I just I find my place. And when it was new at work, I loved young people, but I loved that part of how do I make the the environment better? How do I create the equip the people to know who to be better so they are better at reaching? And it was all that development stuff. And, so I went there. I was hungry to to go to anything, and I I went to this conference and heard Blake. And Blake was telling the story of Tom's shoes where he was traveling to South America. He was on holidays, after selling a business, and he saw kids didn't have shoes, and he thought, how do I get shoes to these kids? And he had $5,000 to his name. And he says, if I spend $5,000, I could buy shoes and give them to the kids, but where do I get the next $5,000 to give the next batch of shoes? So he got shoes made in that location, took them back to America, but this idea that I'll start selling shoes to friends and family with a commitment that every pair of shoes I give a pair of shoes to a child. It was called Tom's, a better tomorrow, one for one.
Dave Linton [00:33:19]:
Now America doesn't have social enterprise structure, so it was business where we have different structure here, because philanthropy and wealth doesn't go hand in hand in The UK the way it does in America. So I was triggered with this, and I was a I was in a fast list and a promoter of Tom's shoes. I never wore shoes because they never really were my style. But I I was a promoter. I was telling everyone about this brand company. And then I met with this black bin bag story of, you know, kids named bags. I I did I wonder could I create a bag brand that sells a bag, and every time I sell a bag, I give a bag. And that's what Madlow became.
Dave Linton [00:34:02]:
And that was the that was the story of how I know. It wasn't as easy as just doing that. You know? Yep. But that's that's what the where the idea came from.
James Glover [00:34:12]:
Well, I mean, the like, there's just just an an amazing an amazing story, Dave, that I've I've there's just so much I wanna unpick. Like, I've been scribbling notes to the point where my arm hurts, because, like, even if you just talk about your kind of journey into being a youth worker, right, the fact that you were blagging your blagging your way into becoming an architectural assistant and then the universe went, no. I don't think so. We're gonna, you know, bring a recession, and that's gonna and you threw in the towel. Like, I'm I'm there's a parent there's something in you that's going, alright. I gave it my best shot here, and that's not worked out. So I'm just gonna step away for a moment. And in that pause, in that kind of that just that real the the what's the word I'm looking for? Not release, but that kind of just willingness to kinda step away, something new emerged,
Dave Linton [00:35:03]:
which
James Glover [00:35:03]:
was spending time in youth work. And and again, you used the word role modeling in the same way that you used role modeling from from, from your mum with this gentleman that you'd spent, time working with who was like, it's all about connection and how do you create connection and make connection. And so there's there's something here about seeing again somebody else do something that really feels meaningful and the power in that in terms of the the impact that it had on you. And I love that you were like, I wanna be at the edge. Right? Like, being at the like, the ones that nobody else wants to speak to, they're the ones I wanna they're the ones I wanna be with. Like, you know, you talked about your mom standing up for people, and you use this language of kind of underdog. There's almost like the underdog nature of but this is for you, it's about the kids, like, rather than just kind of the people that she she was working around that almost drove you into this place of, like, wow. At 22 years, like, from a 10 I'm doing this because I'm on the goal to this is my place and this is where I'm gonna be.
James Glover [00:36:03]:
And I don't even know where to begin with the kind of the the the the kind of the meeting of you. Like, you having a desire to potentially foster at some point, and then all of a sudden, there is this woman in the world who is already fostering all by herself. Like, I don't know if that's a gift from the universe or what, but, that that that journey but the thing that's just kind of stolen my soul a little bit and, like, in a in a really wonderful way is when you just started talking about self worth. And, like, these kids breathe, therefore, they have value. Like, I'm not sure that there is gonna be or I'm ever gonna hear a more powerful definition of self worth and value than that, Dave, if I'm honest. And, a big part of the reason why the work of the excitable soul is is is important to me is that more people just need to feel like they have a sense of self worth. They just need to feel like they're enough. That is it.
James Glover [00:37:01]:
And so for you turning around and going, well, actually, these guys, they breathe, therefore, they have value, and they they just have to, they have to be able to feel that and appreciate that more. They have to be able to see that somebody else recognizes and acknowledges that in them. And how do we do it? Well, dignity is a start. And if and if and if part of creating a level of dignity is being able to ensure that they put their things in something that isn't a disposable bag, Like, wow. What a beautiful way of taking something that is deep, meaningful, and significant and turning it into something that's pragmatic and actionable, which again feels like you harking back to your mom. This isn't about nurturing. This is about what do we do about it. And, and and I also really loved here the, the the being able to see and utilize your dyslexia as a super strength, which is, alright.
James Glover [00:37:56]:
I can do this this way, but none of that turns me on. None of that am I interested in. All of that feels like hard work. All of that feels like effort. And, actually, even if I succeed that way, what comes with it, I'm not interested in either. There's gotta be a different way. There's gotta be a better way. And what does that look like? And the fact that that sent you then down the route of starting a business, anybody that started a business knows that that's not easy, at all.
James Glover [00:38:21]:
So in when you hear that kind of played back, Dave, what are some of the things that start to to kinda show up for you? What are some of the moments within all of that that felt like real kind of inflection points?
Dave Linton [00:38:32]:
So I I think things are not taught. They're caught. And and they're they come out of a place of so the value worth dignity piece, for me comes out of a a place of, you know, the how people have treated me. So so it's it's generally it's nothing as a is a is a people around when the times it's not choosing to be a friend rather than have to be your friend. You know? So I I was out with a with a a good friend and was talking about supporting people and, you know, and going through challenges in life, and they they said, to me that, you know, they come back and says, oh, you have let me down. You you that, you know, and all of this stuff. And, you know, and he this person said to me it just says, you don't get to choose. I am your friend.
Dave Linton [00:39:31]:
And I just thought there's something powerful about that. And, and that's generally because one is that's happened to that person, I'm sure, and it's been passed on. You know, there's a there's a sign around value is we value what we do, and what we do is what we value. And we talk about value as something that is a it becomes a value statement. But is it actually what we do? And if we say it's what we do, then what we really do is what we value. And that's that's the part where I'm really trying to to to bring this into the the care system is that, actually, this is not just words. This is generally you know, I I will I will go and spend time. The people the people there's I haven't met a young person that I would wanna invite home to have dinner with, and yet probably society says there's stigma that goes with it.
Dave Linton [00:40:30]:
You know, the the the young people are valuable, and and I just, and that's been my experience. I haven't met anybody in the ten years I've been doing Mad Dog, and I've got to meet people at all stages. Last week, I was with some guy that's still on license and just got out. Most amazing fun weekend person I have met in in years. And I sat down, and I saw a guy of real value and real worth, and I engaged in the connection. Only downside was he supported a different football team than I. And, but even that wasn't enough to to to separate that. He he he we we just sat down and and connected, and we've been connect through LinkedIn.
Dave Linton [00:41:16]:
And, you know, I've sent them a bag and said that you're incredible. And but just, you know, where I'm sure in his community and people around, I've wrote him off, stigmatized this guy. Most amazing guys. Guy's gonna do amazing, amazing stuff in society and make a difference. And at 21, and dress different from me. Everything was different, and yet I I would I would invite him even in license. With my own kids in the house, I would fight him for dinner. No problem.
Dave Linton [00:41:46]:
Because he's got huge value. Now there's risk. But I'll I would I would have no issue with that.
James Glover [00:41:51]:
How do you how do you manage, mitigate the kind of the risk element, Dave? Like, I'm, the you know, completely transparently, I'm having my own personal reaction to to to the experiences and the kind of the freedom and that you that you, that you talk with in terms of the kind of the engagement here and your willingness to engage in those ways. And I can imagine that there'll be people listening going, wow. Like, how do you how do you do that? So how do you do that? Right? How do you how do you manage the risk and the kind of the sense of protectionism or, you know, mitigate bias and stigma to kinda see through to the soul? Like, how does that work for you?
Dave Linton [00:42:33]:
Well, you you have to I think you have to give up self. You know, if you go in with the risk, you go in with the self. Now there's being wise, and there's all of the following safeguard and processes. And, you know, there's there's there's been totally totally wise. But I what my experience has been when you show genuine care, actually, it breaks, and it brings people to beyond that facade. You know, when you as a youth worker, when I sat down with those kids on the edge that everybody couldn't do, when I sat down on a sofa with a PlayStation controller and just play a PlayStation, and just ask them about everything. And I learned how to ask lots of questions, and show care, and tell them they were welcomed back the next night. And then then to go first to them when they came in the room rather than to the cool young people that I everyone else wanted to be around.
Dave Linton [00:43:31]:
The ones who were no problem to like and no problem to then they were in your face, and they were telling you, you are brilliant as a youth worker, and we love you, Dave. And, you know, that's that's self. And then you're looking at the world around, and and a lot of serving is is what we get from it. But when you can lay self down and go actually, you know, I'm not motivated for money. I'm not motivated for this. I'm just motivated to be Dave and to care. That is the part where where I see the the the breakthrough, where I come in with no judgments, even if I have different views, even if I have different beliefs, even if I have different faith structures, even if I have different is I never allow that to become the the barrier to engage.
James Glover [00:44:18]:
Yeah. That I mean, wallop. The like, the power of that, Dave. Like, the simplicity of the sentiment, which is just kind of lay down self. But the fact that you are talking about being able to hold real tension there between I can have a view, I can have a perspective, my experiences, all of those things, I can hold those and suspend judgment at the same time. Mhmm. Like, that feels like something that is within the grasp of all of us, but, actually, we we take all of those things and allow them to shape judgment. They're the things that inform how quickly we make a judgment or how judgmental we can be rather than being able to say, no.
James Glover [00:45:02]:
I can hold all of those things. I don't have to let go of all of those things, and I can also be free of judgment for a while. So how do you how do you do that? How do you keep yourself out of a place of judgment?
Dave Linton [00:45:16]:
I I have no answer for this apart from my my my fears. I just see people as people, and I'm I feel I have a call in this world to love people. You know? That's the that's the the pure thing, is it just to to care and to be that and, you know, lay down any agenda. You know? So even whenever whenever you approach people, my only agenda is to show love. And that's not fluffy love. You know? My only agenda is to show show and be div and to allow people to see and experience love. And that's the that's the the part for me is the, and that's been a journey because I have been, you know, there's been moments of insecurity. There's been moments of all of the stuff that goes through that where, you know, you love the the the the you know, people feed your egos and stuff like that.
Dave Linton [00:46:28]:
And and I think twenty two years in youth work for me was taken all of that stuff, and now I'm in business. And I I get great opportunities. I get to to go to great places. I get to meet great people. And, and yet the people I've genuinely still love to be alongside is the ones on the edge. You know, what I had breakfast in 2018, with four other entrepreneurs, five other entrepreneurs in London with Richard Branson. And you're sitting there and you're going, and that was a great experience. But, actually, my experience at the weekend with a group of, lived and learned experienced leaders was was more powerful.
Dave Linton [00:47:17]:
My my experience last week in Newcastle when I went to a school who had done some fundraising and support for the work of MadLog, and to sit to go into that school where it was, it it wasn't even special needs school. It was a school for those who were expelled from school. And every every door had locks and pass cards and stuff like that. And every corridor, I saw young people with staff. And I was warned before going in that, you know, that that you could experience and see things here because, you know, the the young people that they're working with. And I sat down with the head of that or the VP of that school and the staff member, And, and I said to them, I said, see if this school was on my doorstep. I'd be a plan for a job. And and that's when, you know, I run a business, social enterprise.
Dave Linton [00:48:14]:
I get to to go and meet Richard Branson. I've been to Buckingham Palace. I win awards, and yet that's where where my real heart lies. And and it's been a bit of a journey in that business place because for me, I've up until I've always I'm still a youth worker. I'm still a youth worker. I've had to learn my business coach, leadership coach has been basically, you know, Dave, you're now a business leader. So now my terminology is I'm a business leader with the heart of a youth worker. And, and that's the that's the stuff.
Dave Linton [00:48:52]:
Probably at the heart of all of that, and I and I haven't engaged in this too early on in the the podcast, is that I have a deep faith that gives me a grounding in that space, but I don't let that become the determination or the judger or the stuff like that. So I'm very secure on my own, and I go and I live that out in the in the world that I I live.
James Glover [00:49:15]:
Yeah. You just beautifully articulated why, how, and what there. You know, the kind of the role that you're playing right now is one of business leader, but, actually, how you how you bring yourself to that role actually is born out of the kind of the love and care and the desire to be at the edge that was born out of twenty two years of youth work and, you know, being at a kitchen table with the underdogs, and all of that being, fueled by, I guess, a faith and belief in something that creates a level of kind of security and and significance within you. Yeah. Amazing, Dave. And I I I I guess one final question for me, really, is when you look forward from this point, like, what are the things that at the at the like, what's next? Like, what really ex what what's exciting you? What do you think the leaps of faith look like, that might take you forward into the future? What are your kind of hopes and aspirations and dreams around the things that are important to you right now?
Dave Linton [00:50:21]:
So as a visionary, I I I I really want MadLog to become a or to be to grow into being the the leading, bag brand for consciously socially conscious consumers and corporates. And, and we're we're not there, like, in The UK, so we would deal with every kid in care make move in with 50,000 bags a year being given. So it's still significant. We've given a 20,000 bags in a journey. That's equivalent to 1,200,000 of, money value. Never mind the the impact that the that that's had on self worth and stuff like that. With every bag we give, James, just that value worth has that on the bag. So it says you're incredible, value worth dignity.
Dave Linton [00:51:08]:
And and what we're what supposed the vision for MadLog is it started off as this idea of funding bags. But now what we're seeing is we're creating a brand that is love without words. So we're connecting society, removing the stigmas. We're using it as an educator promoter of children and young people who are who are often unseen outside of the professional world. And we're doing this of when you wear a bag, a child who knows about Mad Dog feels seen. They feel loved. So it's like, we see you. We know you.
Dave Linton [00:51:41]:
We love you. We believe in you. That is the the message. And so for us for me, my vision is is just to keep focused. As a dyslexic, the the the thing is we can we can get so away off in so many ideas in the creative space. And I've had to actually learn to journal lots, all my creative ideas, and be and what I've done is give a lot of it away. Because, actually, I can't I have to just realize I can't do it all. So I've just journaling, and I meet someone, they go, here.
Dave Linton [00:52:12]:
I I journaled this. Here's an idea. It might help you get started with a business idea. Here's a here's a product idea. Here's that. No. That's not the way the world generally lives because it's, like, protect. And then, you know, I'll get to that.
Dave Linton [00:52:23]:
And if you don't get to it, the world doesn't get to see that. But I think I'm learning having to really focus on being intentionally focused on the thing that is is my call, which is the value of dignity of children, young people in the care, and to to ensure that no child has life in a bin bag. So my my next stage is to keep growing that. I've just hired a head of ops to do the day to day running off, of MadLog so that I can be free to do more of this, James, and more of the, sharing the heart and the compassion and the the vision and the connecting with some potential corporate customers and so forth. And then probably longer term, like, I still got probably about you know, I never retired, I don't think, because work I don't work. I I just live. And, but I think in the in the working paid capacity rule type stuff, I probably got about north tenth to fifteen years unless health gets in the way. And I'm doing this in a little bit, but I think in the longer longer term, it's then how do I empower other people that we can multiply the that this kind of movement of impact.
Dave Linton [00:53:48]:
So I can help other people and mentor other people and inspire other people to to be doing grounded leadership within social impacting environment. That's where I'm going. And then the other part is, I think MadLog is now the stage where it needs to grow into a community it needs to deepen its community roots and go deeper, and empower and connect as a community rather than a brand just doing meta ads and Google ads. And so we're we're we're consciously thinking, like, how do we just take this and just grow it in a place where it's less about the perfect model on the the the website. Can we really build this as a a DNA of a community of people who genuinely are saying, we see you, we know you, your huge value, worth dignity. So that's that's where where we're going.
James Glover [00:54:47]:
Well, the second that we finish there, Dave, I'm getting on the website, and I'm buying some bags. And that is the, the only way I can express the emotion I'm feeling right now, which is, get out there as wherever is opportunity for you to get out there because you are incredibly powerful. Like, I have just sat here and been blown away by the journey that you've been on, your willingness to kind of share the experiences that you've had and the impact that you're trying to create in the world. And, well, the excitable soul will do whatever it can, wherever it can to help advance that mission, in our own small way. So Amazing. Wherever we can be part of your community, we're we're we're fully up for it.
Dave Linton [00:55:37]:
James, can I can I just give a couple of wee things to other excitable soul people who have got something burning inside that they they wanna do? So couple of wee learnings on this because it wasn't easy. You know, like, how you get from from an idea by a company. So it was £500, no investors, reinvesting, no salary for three years, all of that stuff. Couple of wee things just if if something is burning, the the key to it is find their black bin backstory. The black bin backstory is the story within the story. Too often we get excited about broad and then get excited about the the and it seems like people around me told me it's only it's only a bin bag. There's bigger problems to fix, but that has become the thing that has kept me focused. And the other key things is money always follows vision.
Dave Linton [00:56:23]:
And Blake McCoskey in his book put a thing that says, you know, someday we'll take your dreams to the degree. If if it's so important to you, just do it, and the course will work itself out. And I and I I look back. I was 42 and started my log. I look back and I go, how many some days where take, you know, rob the dreams? Because this wasn't the first dream. This wasn't the first opportunity. This wasn't the first thing I got excited about. But the someday, I'll have more money.
Dave Linton [00:56:50]:
Someday, I'll be married. Someday, I'll have a university degree. Robbed all of that, and we had it and we had it and we had it. So I've learned that some to let the someday. And often the someday for many people is the money. But my view is you just get out and you don't let that someday, and the money always follows because people follow the vision. And, and that that's that's my two bits of advice is money following vision, delay the Sunday, and find find find the black bin bike. Because the black bin bike is a negative, but it's an excitable driver in me that I can see an end and a fix to one wee thing that actually is huge for children, young people, and keeps me on track and stops me from getting distracted.
James Glover [00:57:40]:
Yeah. Amazing. Thank you, Dave. Just yeah. Thank you. This was incredible. Your work is incredible. You are incredible.
James Glover [00:57:49]:
And, thank you for bringing love to the world because lord knows we need more of it right now. So thank you.
Dave Linton [00:57:56]:
Very welcome. Thanks for having us on your podcast.
James Glover [00:57:59]:
Brilliant. And ladies and gents, you'll be able to find all the links to, to Madeluk in the show notes. So please go check them out and support their mission. Massive thank you for taking the time to listen to the excitable soul podcast. If you are interested in uncovering, understanding, and unleashing your sense of purpose, come and explore our purpose immersion programs at theexcitablesoul.com. We look forward to hearing from you there or being with you on our next episode. Have an incredible day.