Episode #16: Sarah Broadhead

A Journey of Self-Discovery and Career Courage: Finding Meaning in Work and Life

In this week's episode I sit down with the remarkable Sarah Broadhead, an occupational psychologist and author whose life's work revolves around facilitating personal growth and understanding.

Sarah takes us on a journey through her influences, from her beloved English teacher to her spirited grandmother. Discover how her deep empathy and passion for helping others are fuelled by her own experiences and how a man named Pete changed not just his life but Sarah's outlook on the power of coaching.

Sarah also dives into the significance of storytelling in finding life's purpose, the role of feedback in personal development, and why taking risks can be the pivot point in shaping a fulfilling career.

Links in this episode:

Perform & Thrive: A Sportsperson’s Guide to Mental Health and Wellbeing

Read the transcript here

James Glover [00:00:09]:

Alrighty. Welcome to the Excitable Soul podcast. Here, we are interested in all things purpose. We want to know where and how people find Meaning and connection in their lives. In every episode, we're gonna be hearing the real life stories of how people have uncovered, understood, and unleashed their own unique Sense of purpose. Our hope is that we can all learn from the stories and the journeys of our guests so that we can better find the sense of purpose in our own lives. I'm host, James Glover, performance coach and purpose nerd. I'm incredibly excited to be exploring these stories with you.

James Glover [00:00:44]:

So let's get going, shall we? My guest today is Sarah Broadhead. Sarah is a chartered occupational psychologist starting her career as a business psych. She then moved to elite sport in 2009 and worked with professor Steve Peters as part of the Chimp management company. She supported numerous Olympic and world championship winning athletes and professional sports teams in addition to businesses. Her passion is in helping people more deeply understand themselves so they can perform at their best and thrive in the process. She recently published the book Perform and Thrive, A sportsperson's guide to mental health and well-being. This is a great conversation with an expert practitioner exploring what has really shaped and motivated their work. Hello, Sarah Broadhead.

James Glover [00:01:36]:

Welcome to the Excitable Soul Podcast. Mega, to have you with us today. Super excited for our conversation. How are you feeling?

Sarah Broadhead [00:01:45]:

I'm great. I'm really good. I'm really excited about it. Yeah. I think it's gonna be be some interesting conversations.

James Glover [00:01:53]:

I'm a 100% sure it will be. Hopefully, our listeners have started to become accustomed to our format. But just for those of you who may be new to the way in which we do things on this podcast, is, we're talking about all things purpose. We're talking about where people find meaning and connection in their lives. And, we explore that through 3 different perspectives. The first is where and how have people uncovered their sense of purpose? And that's really about Connecting the dots. It's kind of looking back at our journey to date and understanding the people and the moments that really shaped who we are. And then kind of getting into right.

James Glover [00:02:32]:

Well, I've uncovered it. So how what do I understand of it? Now where where have I created meaning? Where do I find self worth in, in in my day to day life. And then the final pit is is kind of really unleashing it. How do we put it into practice, into action, help it, make more possible in in our world. So our conversation follows these kinda 3, 3 threads, And, and we we post some pretty big questions, which we'll start with. Right, Sarah? So, Let's let's kinda hit the territory of uncovering purpose for you. Who are who are some of the people that have really shaped who you are? What are some of the experiences that really stand out to When you think about who you've become?

Sarah Broadhead [00:03:17]:

Yeah. That is a big question to start with, isn't it? We like to talk

James Glover [00:03:21]:

more gently in terms

Sarah Broadhead [00:03:22]:

of I know. I know. See, when I thought about it, I think I almost think about the Different stages of my life, and I think there's been people at every stage of of that of my life. And but at the early Stage is is understandably, it's teachers, isn't it? It's like the they're probably the the people that you have outside your family that have the most influence on you. And There was, an English teacher called missus O'Donnell, and she was just really outgoing and vibrant, and she'd tell all these, She'd give you, like, all these life lessons. So she wasn't just teaching English. She was she'd say things like, oh, it's better to have loved and lost than not I've loved it all and it's like you're gonna get your heart broken, but it's okay. It's part of life and you'll be okay.

Sarah Broadhead [00:04:07]:

Like, just things that you wouldn't maybe expect an English teacher to be teaching you, So I really remember her. She was really powerful.

James Glover [00:04:14]:

What was it about those life lessons? What was it about heard that, you know, all of these years later, obviously not that many years later, still really stands out to you and kind of creates that level of emotional connection?

Sarah Broadhead [00:04:29]:

I think it was it was partly just her her personality and she was so passionate about the subject. But also I think Maybe, like, you didn't get that from your parents. Like, they weren't sitting and telling you those life lessons. So at that age, you didn't really Get it anywhere else. So it was a bit like, oh, okay. So, yeah, it it was good.

James Glover [00:04:48]:

It almost feels like there's there's kind of, like, some Being exposed to some kind of truth in those moments that maybe you're not hearing or experiencing anywhere else.

Sarah Broadhead [00:04:58]:

Yeah definitely, yeah, yeah, so she she definitely stood out. I tried googling her the other day and it didn't work, so I have no idea where she is or what she's doing but Yeah. So do you sometimes you wanna go back and tell these people, don't you? They maybe don't know the impact they had on you.

James Glover [00:05:15]:

What would you tell her If you had the opportunity to go back and see

Sarah Broadhead [00:05:19]:

her. Yeah. Just probably what what I said then there, that she had that impact And also, like, it gave me a love of reading and writing and I think that that just sparked that enthusiasm. So maybe she'd, yeah, she'd be pleased to know What I've been doing and that she was quite inspiring and, yeah, I think she'd like to know that.

James Glover [00:05:39]:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The author, Sarah Broadhead going back and telling your English teacher the kind of level of inspiration. Amazing. Amazing. So you're talking about phases and people and the kind of, like, teachers in an earlier phase. Who else is in there for you?

Sarah Broadhead [00:05:58]:

Probably my my nan would would be in there. So, she was around till maybe always, like, Thirty, I would say. But she she was a big influencer. So she, she grew up in Birmingham. She was the inspiration. So my uncle wrote Peaky Blinders, so she was the inspiration for Peaky Blinders.

James Glover [00:06:18]:

Really? Which which character was she the inspiration for?

Sarah Broadhead [00:06:31]:

Like, her kids so she had 7 kids. She told them all the stories of what it was like growing up in Birmingham and All the the gang stuff, so that's where he got the inspiration from and she liked writing as well, so she she wrote like her life memoirs and I've got it printed out In my my room here. So, yeah, she was she was, like, she loved football, like, in that era. It was quite unusual for Women's like football. She's a big Birmingham City supporter. She goes to lots of matches. She's always at the life and soul of the party. And she I yeah.

Sarah Broadhead [00:07:04]:

She's just great.

James Glover [00:07:06]:

And and again, there's some yeah. Like, just connecting a dot in in my own head, like, creating a bit of curiosity here. You talked about The kind of the size of the personality of your English teacher, and then you're just talking about the life and soul of the party of your of your gran. Like, what What did you take from being around these kind of people? What was it that impacted on you?

Sarah Broadhead [00:07:27]:

I think probably because it's quite different to my personality, so I'm not gonna be the loudest one in the room, but I'm kind of drawn to people that are, I think, so that's probably a theme that's that's continued really. Yeah. I I like being around people that that are that even though I'm not that.

James Glover [00:07:44]:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Interesting. And so, you talked about your grand being around until you were 30. What were some of the big the kind of the big lessons? Like, you know, your school teacher is telling you that there's that you're gonna get your heart broken, but it's gonna be okay, what are some of the things that kind of really stick with you from from your gran?

Sarah Broadhead [00:08:03]:

I think just That she'd have, like, just have fun at life. Remember, like, we'd go to her house so she can like, you'd always just be laughing all the time. Like, she Yeah. She just like to have fun, which I would think is a really nice life lesson, isn't it?

James Glover [00:08:19]:

Yeah. For sure. There are worse things in life than having fun. Right? And and and what about, what about moments in your life where you kind of realized, You know what? I'm not sure anything is gonna be the same off the back of this.

Sarah Broadhead [00:08:35]:

Yeah. A couple, I think. So I grew up in quite a small village in Worcester and then when I went to uni, I was like, where where shall I go? So Applied to Manchester. Applied to Exeter, Bristol, I think. And then I just thought if I go to Exeter, it's the same place as Worcester, basically. It's just another smallish town and, so was that right? I'm gonna go to Manchester, but I was quite scared. I was really excited. I really wanted to go to university, but I got there, and, I just remember me and my friend, like, we were in the same halls of residence, and we wanted to go and see our other friend that was in this other one.

Sarah Broadhead [00:09:13]:

And if anyone knows Manchester, it's down Oxford Road and we had to walk through like Maasai and all that area obviously we didn't know where we were going and we were like oh this is really scary, and we were both from Worcester, we were like, oh my god. This is really scary. So it took a little while to settle in, but I think it did really did me Did me a good service going somewhere completely different, opened your eyes to, like, big cities and Yeah. So I'm glad I didn't take the comfortable route and go to a smaller, smaller, like, kind of campus university.

James Glover [00:09:51]:

Because there's something about, I'm kind of jumping around the journey a little bit, but, you know, when we're talking about kind of unleashing sense of purpose, There is something about leaps of faith in that not kind of really knowing or understanding with any level of, Rational, logical, clarity why you're doing something, but just a total emotional conviction. So what what was what were you experiencing that made you go, you know what? I don't really know how this is gonna play out, but I'm I'm good. I'm doing it. I'm in. Let's go.

Sarah Broadhead [00:10:25]:

I don't I don't again, I don't think it was a conscious thing. I think maybe it was just a that's too similar. I want something different. And I definitely felt at that age I was ready to leave home, ready to go and explore the world. So maybe I think I just thought, I just I wanna make sure it's different. I don't wanna just do the same thing. So maybe I didn't realize I don't think I realized how different it would be. And and I think I remember that 1st term feeling, like, quite homesick, I think, or, like, missing my my college friends a lot because we had, like, a good Group of college friends and just thinking and it because it takes a while, doesn't it, to establish new friendships and, but, yeah, I'd say probably after Christmas, I felt loads better there.

James Glover [00:11:09]:

And how do you think that experience has then shaped who you are now, being able to take that leap of faith and say, no. I wanted something different and be able to make it work for you. How do you think that has shaped who you are?

Sarah Broadhead [00:11:24]:

Probably set me up to do it again at various other points because nothing bad did happen and it turned out really well. So maybe, again, You don't really think about these things, but maybe kind of subconsciously, it sets you up to do it again in the future.

James Glover [00:11:39]:

Yeah. And and, you know, people would have heard from the the introduction that, you know, you're you're a practitioner of this work as much as you, you know, you're kind of experiencing it and reflecting and kind of trying to understand it for yourself. When you when you ask people to kind of explore their journeys and kind of discover purpose. How how are you doing it? How are you asking them to kind of really figure out where meaning comes from?

Sarah Broadhead [00:12:09]:

I'm a big fan of getting people to just share their life story. And, again, it's quite a big question, isn't it? Or, so I've recently just started at, a new working with a a women's football team and, like, meeting lots of people for the 1st time and starting to work with them. And, yeah, getting them to just say, tell me about your life, how did you get into football, what places and just getting them to talk through their journey. And you just learn So much about someone and, like, the meaning they make of things and what's important to them and so, yeah, that's that's my favorite approach probably is just Just saying just start from whenever, but tell me about your life and how you've got to where you are now.

James Glover [00:12:51]:

And I can I can imagine that that bit of Start from whenever, but tell me? And there's if they go and pick any point to start telling the story, the next question is, that's really interesting. Why did you pick that moment? Yeah.

Sarah Broadhead [00:13:06]:

Yeah. Yeah.

James Glover [00:13:09]:

And I I totally agree with you. I think when it comes to purpose, storytelling is a critical, critical element of it. And Brene Brown, I think, describes this best in that She just says, you know, stories are data with a soul. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's just so beautifully eloquent And true in that you're getting insight and information, but it's not just the practical, rational steps of experiences. It's the emotive moments, and the kind of the internal insights that come with all of that at the same time, which I'm not sure you get any other way, unless you kind of have a shared experience of something in the same moment. Storytelling's almost the only other way to be able to create that same kind of connection.

Sarah Broadhead [00:13:56]:

Yeah. Exactly. And and it's something that you probably wouldn't do unless you were asked to do it. Like, you don't often sit down and go, I'm just gonna think about my whole life story and Many of it. You just wouldn't tend to do it, would you?

James Glover [00:14:08]:

No. No. So, so tell us some stories, Sarah. Tell us some stories about, About how and where you kind of make sense of the world around you now. So, like, what does what what does kinda where where do you find meaning In in things now, what's kind of significant and important to you in the in this phase of your life and who you are in your journey?

Sarah Broadhead [00:14:34]:

So what is really important to me is that I feel like I am helping people, helping them have better quality of life That they understand themselves better. Probably because I struggle I'd worried I have a lot of brain that likes to worry quite a lot and I wish that I'd known what I know now early on in life. So I want to be able to share that with people. And I think One of the earliest moments for me where I was like, oh, how powerful it is to help people and how, yeah, how much I was, oh, this is this is brilliant. Like, this is The impact it can have, was in my 1st job as a psychologist, I was a business psychologist and we did a lot of Things like so it must have been about 22, 23. We did a lot of assessment centers and development centers, but we also got to go in and coach people. So I went to it was like a big shipbuilder in in Portsmouth, and I got, given Pete, this Gentleman in his fifties to coach, and I don't know what he thought. He thought, like, who is this person? Like, she's 23.

Sarah Broadhead [00:15:39]:

Like, what's she there? And I felt a bit like, I don't really know what I'm doing. And I kinda had the structure of what coaching looked like, but I was like, I don't yeah. I don't really know How this is gonna go? And I think I've been given Pete because he was a bit, like, grumpy at work and he Didn't always come across that well and he so I got got chatting to him and, then he started again, like, stories, he started Saying about how he'd, like, lost contact with his son and they'd kind of fallen out, and then he was being quite stubborn, and he didn't wanna get back in touch with All of this stuff. And I just think I just remember saying, oh, do you think you might regret that when you're 80 or 90? Or Or is there a way that that you could get back in touch with them? Or we just had those sorts of conversations and we worked together for a while. And then I got an email from him after the coaching he had finished, and he was like, I got back in touch with my son. Like, thank you for you know, I I could have Died alone, like, miserable, and and I was just, oh my god. That's really powerful. And that was really, like, one of my first coaching clients.

Sarah Broadhead [00:16:48]:

Then I think I realized, oh, I really enjoyed this and you can actually make a difference to someone's life. So that was probably where that kind of enthusiasm for it started.

James Glover [00:16:58]:

And what a question to ask somebody in that moment. Think you're gonna regret that When you're 80 or 90 years old. Like, that's yeah. It's one of those really simple but deeply confronting questions For people, isn't it? To to be able to kind of put themselves project themselves forward into the future and go, what might that be like? Actually, it's not something I necessarily want, so come back into this moment here and now and do something about it.

Sarah Broadhead [00:17:29]:

Yeah. And that's why he was grumpy because he was just really sad. So that kind of made him a happy person, which is Good.

James Glover [00:17:37]:

And so, you know, I'm I'm curious as to why that was why that felt important to you. And, you know, It really has kind of shaped your career, a very successful career, which we can also, you know, kind of dive more deeply into. So what was it about it that really made you feel, like, kind of, like, self worth and feel valued? You were just talking about Pete and, The the kind of the the things that really stuck stood out to me, the things that really landed strongly with me when you use the words like, ah, this is really powerful, and, You know, you can really help people with that. I'm really curious. What what was the impact For you, like, the experience you were having, like, what was powerful about it for you? Like, when you talk about helping people, there's loads of ways in which you could help people. So what was it This experience that made me you go, yes. More of that, please. Yeah.

Sarah Broadhead [00:18:36]:

I think it was feeling like you'd Help someone improve their life or reduce their suffering. And I think I I feel like quite a lot of Empathy for people. So I I don't really want people to have to suffer unnecessarily. And obviously, life is always tough things and it's gonna be difficult, but You often see people suffering when they don't need to suffer because they're creating because they don't know how to manage They're mindful, they don't understand themselves or they haven't done a lot of the work that we do They're just suffering when they don't need to suffer. So I think because I have that Ability to really empathize with people. I can imagine what it must be like. And I think, oh, I, I don't want it to be like that.

James Glover [00:19:20]:

Yeah. And you mentioned something before as well. I have a bit of an, I have a bit of a brain that likes to worry. So there's almost like, I'm again, just Kind of imagining you, a, being able to empathize with people, but also really personally experiencing some of that So and how, like, bringing those 2 things together feels feels like like a like a really deep intrinsic motivation for you.

Sarah Broadhead [00:19:49]:

Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. And I think, when I when I first met Steve, I think Steve Peters, that was the first time that I'd really heard anyone talk about how the brain works. So in all my, like, my study of psychology and probably my coaching stuff, you you've learned theories and and kind of understand how people work, but that was the 1st time that it had been put into a a model or a framework that and I was like, oh, wow. That really makes sense. So That was really helpful as well to then go, okay. I've got a bit more of a structured way of helping people or I can give them insights that they maybe haven't had before.

Sarah Broadhead [00:20:25]:

And it still amazes me that I did a talk this week, a rugby club that I work with. And I just sometimes say, oh, everyone knows How the brain works. Everyone has heard of this, and then, like, they they haven't. And I'm like, fuck. And that's part of my, drive as well is, Ed, helping people know information that they they don't help help them know information they don't know.

James Glover [00:20:49]:

Yeah. That I guess that that makes me kind of feel like, you know, what is it about those things that then have become meaningful for you? So there's something about understanding and help people understand. There's something about the kind of the direction and progress that people can make, and there's something about kind of, like, your personal experience of all of that. Like, what How does that shape then the kind of the the almost the strongest sources of expectation that you experience in your life. Like, where do they come from, and and why are they there and present for you?

Sarah Broadhead [00:21:26]:

Yeah. Expectation I put on myself would be about trying to make sure I do a good job with someone or if I feel like I haven't Got a connection, then I'll think, oh, why haven't I? Or why why couldn't I help that person? So, yeah, that's probably the expectation I put on myself is, oh, I should be able to help everyone.

James Glover [00:21:46]:

And how do you then, how do you then manage that? Because for all of us, Right? I think this is just really wonderful for our listeners. We have somebody who's literally a world class practitioner and being able to help people and, like, an epic track record of, You know, what that what that looks like. And, we all have this kind of inner environment that's maybe saying, I should do this or I Could do this or why haven't I done this? So how do you then how do you then manage that in order to continue to kind of learn and grow and develop rather than, like you day kind of allow that worry part of the brain to take over.

Sarah Broadhead [00:22:23]:

Yeah. So it's it's, I think, understanding or Knowing what doing your best is, I think I've got a lot better at being able to reflect and say that that was me doing my best in that situation. If it worked out, brilliant. If it didn't quite go how I wanted it, I can reflect and learn on it. But I've got loads, loads better at at doing that.

James Glover [00:22:44]:

So talk us through it, Sarah. Right? This is, this is you not being the practitioner. This is you being, like, the the kind of the client in this moment. Talk to us about how you've done that because I can imagine there are people just sat there going, yeah, that's all well and good, but I can Still try and tell myself I've done my best and then give myself a really hard time off the back of it too. So what how have you how have you done it?

Sarah Broadhead [00:23:09]:

I think support from other people has been massive. So I've had some really good mentors or colleagues or bosses or people that That can you can talk things through with and then they can go, yeah. You did that well. You can maybe improve that. So getting that objective feedback It's really important. I remember, like, when I first started working my 1st psychology consultancy job and my boss was called Louise. She was this Aussie lady. She's brilliant.

Sarah Broadhead [00:23:37]:

And I hadn't really been used to having feedback at work, and she kinda gave me this feedback. And I was like, oh. And I was like, I didn't I didn't really, like, want it, and I was like, oh. And then And then I was like, oh, okay. Well, she's doing it to try and make me better and actually she has got a point and but I just hadn't had it before. I wasn't used to it. So I think, yeah, having really good people that can support you, challenge you, and then you kind of take on board like, you get that Process yourself so then you can start to do it yourself. You can start to reflect and go be a bit more objective.

Sarah Broadhead [00:24:13]:

So say That that was good. That wasn't so good. But, yeah, I think, initially, it's good to have some support with that because it's really hard just not to be get stuck in the emotions of it and Beat yourself up about it and I

James Glover [00:24:27]:

love that immediate confrontation of, why is this? Like, what? Hold on. What just happened here? What? Why? Why? What? I didn't want that. I don't I don't even know how to feel about that. Can you take that back, please? Let's not do that again.

Sarah Broadhead [00:24:42]:

I can actually remember that I can picture my you don't have those, like, flashbulb memories. I could just remember standing in the office going, oh. It's quite, yeah.

James Glover [00:24:53]:

Well, it's it's interesting because I, had almost the exact opposite experience. Probably be about almost 10 years ago now, I think, working for for somebody who was very much a case of If my expectation is you're gonna do a great job because I really believe in, in in what you bring. So, I'll tell you if you're not.

Sarah Broadhead [00:25:18]:

Okay. Yeah. I'll

James Glover [00:25:19]:

tell you if you're not. Otherwise, you know, you're doing a great job. And I was lost, Like, a 100% luck. It I was wicking out. There was no feedback whatsoever. I had no insight into no personal individual insight into whether or not I was adding value at all. And I was in this total tailspin of, like, what is wrong with me? Like, why can't I be the judge of what's good or not or what feels value add or not? Like, It it it was it was a really, really, powerful experience because I was like, I'm almost totally reliant on the feedback For other people to figure out whether or not I'm enough?

Sarah Broadhead [00:26:03]:

Yeah. Yeah.

James Glover [00:26:04]:

Can't be okay.

Sarah Broadhead [00:26:05]:

No. And and No. And I think that that it's having that balance, isn't it? I think you we can't ignore feedback from other people because that's how we then perceived in the world, But we can't base it our whole self worth purely on that and, another thing that Steve really helped with was, saying like who who are the important people in your life, like who equals your treat, like who's your who are the people that have your back but That you should care what they think and that those relationships are important and then who are the people that will have an opinion about you, but actually that that's okay. That that's they're not part of your core group, and I think that that was massively helpful because otherwise you and I've had those conversations with athletes where They just want especially with social media, they want everyone to like them, everyone's think they're great and you just go, it's not possible. Like, there's no there's no human on earth that everyone likes. I don't think there's anyone.

James Glover [00:27:07]:

What? Hold on. Wait. That's new news to me. Oh, no. We have to have a different me.

Sarah Broadhead [00:27:13]:

We have

James Glover [00:27:14]:

to have a different type of conversation offline here. So so talk to us about, where this kind of journey of of, like, insight has Helped you just make more things possible in your life, Sarah, like where you've been able to kind of take those moments of courage and kind of truth And, and just see different possibilities. Where where have been the moments and times that those have happened for you?

Sarah Broadhead [00:27:46]:

I think probably the biggest one was when I left. So I was working in, so there's probably been a couple of them, and they're all around, like, Job changes really or career changes. So after I did my masters, I worked in a a graduate scheme. I ended up doing tax exams, but, Yeah. I don't know how that happened. So I was in on that scheme for 3 years, and I think I managed to last that long because I had a really good social group and we had a really great time. But I could see that, you know, Some people love love that job but I could see a lot of people that were in their later careers and they had got a big house and a mortgage and a Good salary. I know I can't I can't leave.

Sarah Broadhead [00:28:31]:

They told themselves they couldn't leave, so I was like, well, actually, this is not what I want to do forever. I I need to get out now before I get stuck in it. So that was really the first kind of leap of faith where I was like, right, I'm gonna go and find this job in psychology and I'm starting at the bottom of that, so that was probably the the first one and then the second one was again another career change where I've been doing that psychology consultancy for a number of years, and it was 2009, so it's just after Beijing. And Lots of people like Chris Hoy, Vicki Pendleton were talking about this psychiatrist that they've been working with, and I really love sport. Like, I I, like, used to row a lot And I bike a lot and so I love sport and I was like, I want to be a sports psychologist, that's what I want to do. I wanna help people in sport. That's that's what I wanna do. How do I do that? So I thought I'm gonna have to, like, yeah, we, Like, retrain or I just didn't know where to start with it.

Sarah Broadhead [00:29:31]:

So I had a friend, Denise, and so she's a really important figure in this, who worked at British Cycling. And I said, Denise, can you please get me Steve's email? Like, can you just get me in touch with him? So she got me Jeff, his PA's email. So back and forth with with Jeff trying to get a a call with Steve, and he's like, oh, he's quite busy and yeah. Would this work? No. This won't work. And then Jeff just emails back, and he just says, Steve wants to know if you want a job at taekwondo. So this is a great Britain Taekwondo team in Manchester. And I was like, does he know that I've never worked in sport? I have not got any clue about what's going on.

Sarah Broadhead [00:30:16]:

He said, yeah. It's fine. So I met Steven McDonald at Sport City, And he just he did write what I now know as the commitment screen. So he tried to put me off. He just said that you're gonna be traveling loads. You're gonna Firefighting. It's gonna be egos. It's gonna be it's, like, long hours.

Sarah Broadhead [00:30:32]:

And I was like, yay. Brilliant. Sign me up.

James Glover [00:30:36]:

So in this commitment stream, Wazee, what he's looking for is, is she loopy?

Sarah Broadhead [00:30:41]:

Yeah. Exactly. Yeah.

James Glover [00:30:42]:

She is. Excellent. She's in.

Sarah Broadhead [00:30:46]:

And, apparently, what he liked was so I'd fairly recently started another job. Like, it was like, I'd had a salary increase, and he was like, you're gonna have to take a pay for this job. I said, yeah, that's fine. Like, I was willing to do that. So I think he just thought, oh, she's quite serious about this I'm probably a bit loopy. So

James Glover [00:31:09]:

Amazing. Amazing. And so when you talk about, These kind of 2 moments, these 2 kind of leaps of faith, there is just there's, like, total conviction in your choices. Like Yeah.

Sarah Broadhead [00:31:20]:

I know. I don't

James Glover [00:31:21]:

want that. Yeah. That well, that's what I'm really curious about because, like, what when they show up, you are just able to do things, like, Massive It

Sarah Broadhead [00:31:32]:

wasn't an it wasn't an immediate. So I remember I think I initially said no to Jeff, or I said, can I think about I didn't it wasn't an immediate yes when he because I'd like I said, recently started a job? I was like, I can't let these people down. Yeah, I've made a commitment. I don't know what I'm doing. I've not got any experiences but And I this is why Denise is important in the story because I just remember messaging her going, I'd be really stupid to pass this opportunity, wouldn't I? And she's like, yeah. You would. So I just think I I realized, like, this is an opportunity that you you're not gonna get ever again. And what's the worst that can happen? Like, you go back to what you did before.

Sarah Broadhead [00:32:16]:

So I had a an honest conversation with the the People like and they were like, yeah. You have to do it. Like, we we know we want you to stay, but you have to do it.

James Glover [00:32:25]:

Because there's something really, Beautiful about what you're describing this, Sarah, which is all I had all of these logical, rational reasons for not making this Decision. Anything on the on the on the surface of it, on the face of it that most people would turn around and go, yeah. You're right. So there we are. New job, Salary increase. So you're getting more money. It's gonna influence lifestyle. And, you know, you've made a commitment to this group of people.

James Glover [00:32:55]:

Like, you don't hate it. That's, You know?

Sarah Broadhead [00:32:57]:

Yeah. No. I was I was looking forward

James Glover [00:32:58]:

to that. Yeah. To stay. Totally recent stay. Yet there was still this, There was this feeling. There was this kind of set of of of emotion that was kind of compelling you towards doing something that felt different. And that that word different again. It feels important.

James Glover [00:33:17]:

And the same is kind of choosing, should I go to Exeter? Well, yeah, Exeter's a pretty good university. Like, I think you get a great degree.

Sarah Broadhead [00:33:24]:

Anyone that's been to Exeter. I'm not a slight in Exeter.

James Glover [00:33:28]:

Well, so what you weren't trashing it's a university. Okay. I I think you'll be alright. They're not gonna come looking for you. But but you were just kind of like, well, that that's that's more of the same. I want something different. And in this kind of in this story, it's almost exactly the same situation. It's okay, but it's kind of more of the same.

James Glover [00:33:47]:

I want something different. I'm going after it. Yeah. I wonder I wonder what reflection that maybe cultivates in you right now, just kind of noticing that or acknowledging that.

Sarah Broadhead [00:33:59]:

It probably links to so I've had my own business for 5 years now. And the ability when you have your own business, and that's the scary bit and the exciting bit You see, you get loads of variety and you get to do different things and you can shape what you do.

James Glover [00:34:13]:

Yeah.

Sarah Broadhead [00:34:14]:

And I think that is what I love about it. And, Yeah. It's probably yeah. Built up from wanting those different experiences and sometimes being A bit like, oh, can I do this? Or but, yeah, wanting to have variety.

James Glover [00:34:30]:

And so if you were, if if you were if you were one of our listeners now and, They had the opportunity to just kind of dive into your brain for a moment and be able to kind of, Just extract all of those kind of years of experience and and insight in helping people find more meaningful lives and be able to Make some pretty difficult decisions that helps them overcome the pain or the stuckness. What are the things that you'd want people to take out? What are the things that you would want people to to know and lean into To be able to do that in their own lives?

Sarah Broadhead [00:35:17]:

I think maybe it's that, what's the worst that can happen or That willingness to take a risk, but think, well, actually, is it a risk? Is it like, you can always You can always go back or you can always, like, you know, nothing's permanent. So that's how I, like, I think I saw it was If it doesn't work out, that's okay. That it's not embarrassing me if it doesn't work out. But also again, like, that Support from other people, like, don't think you have to do it on your own, that you can get support and even if you're a bit scared about it, That's alright that you can still do it even if you're scared. I think I've been scared doing lots of these things, but Then you get less scared as you do it.

James Glover [00:36:07]:

I I think there's a a really wonderful, message in what's the worst that can happen, and, the kind of the liberation that that can create for us if we kind of take on that perspective. I also can acknowledge and see the flip side of that as well where people could probably come up with some really horrific things in answering that question for themselves. And so how do you How do you how do you create the kind of the boundary on that?

Sarah Broadhead [00:36:40]:

Someone really early on, I can't remember who it was, said live below your means. So as humans, we have a tendency, Like, you get a salary increase and then you get the big house, you get the bigger car, or you you just spend it or and I think I've always been a a saver. Like, Me and my sister are completely opposite. She'd get a pocket money, it'd be gone. I'd have my pocket money, and I would save it and not wanna spend it. So I think I've always had that tendency. So I've always had, like, been really strict and said, give yourself a bit of a a buffer or don't, like, live to your means. Don't live right up to your means, so that affords me that bit of financial security, I think, to go.

Sarah Broadhead [00:37:24]:

Yeah. What's worse that can happen? Okay. Well, you know that you can live for a couple of months or whatever and that you haven't got this huge mortgage that So but I know that isn't possible for everybody, and I'm in a privileged position that I can do that. But, yeah, that was just some advice that helped me.

James Glover [00:37:43]:

But and the financial element of it is just one part of it though as well. Right? So Yeah. So there's a there's an element of that which is, yes, like, that that level of security is important, but then there's also just the, The kind of the emotional experience that kinda sits around it as well. If you're, oh, what's the worst can happen? Are you joking? Well, the worst that could happen would be, I fail. Are you like, I couldn't possibly tolerate, you know, what that might mean. The shame. The shame. And so There's a part of there's a part of it, I think, which is also how you've been able to to contextualize that.

James Glover [00:38:18]:

Like, you talked about, I feel the fear, and I do it anyway. But how do you get to the point of acknowledging the fear, feeling comfortable with the fear, and doing it anyway, rather than The fear taking you to this place of, well, if I put a foot wrong here, that is the end of me.

Sarah Broadhead [00:38:37]:

Yeah. And that that's part of, I think, what I've Learned over the years is that if you if you talk about it, if you write it down, if you face it so if it stays in our head, Then you go it just goes around in your head. It's really hard to manage. It's really hard to, yeah, get any logical thoughts around it. So Just being able even, like, just people can just start journaling or writing stuff down, like, just understanding a bit more what that What those thoughts are, what those fears are. And then once you've, like, shone a light on them, then they they do Often seem a bit easier to manage. Not always easy, but a little bit easier to manage.

James Glover [00:39:18]:

And how how true is that statement as well? Like, where I was with a group of people this week, and, and we were talking about some of the the kind of the things that maybe create gaps in alignment to what really matters to us. And then you say them out loud to other people and go, wow. Yeah. I feel a bit silly saying that out loud, actually, because it's not a thing.

Sarah Broadhead [00:39:40]:

Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.

James Glover [00:39:41]:

Been such a big thing in my head for such a long time, and now I've been brave enough to say it out. I've, like, taken I've I've been vulnerable, actually. I've kind of I've had the courage to speak some truth, and it's created a completely different Understanding and awareness.

Sarah Broadhead [00:39:59]:

Yeah. So just getting used to just even, like, recognizing what your thoughts are and then Talking them out, writing them down, working through them, that that's just really helpful.

James Glover [00:40:11]:

Yeah. Brilliant. Brilliant. Brilliant. I think there's a, A really wonderful note for us to end on, there, Sarah, in this whole principle of purpose can really simply just be our relationship with the world, So us and what's around us. And that isn't just people. It's experiences and, and The the the need to be outside of our own minds in order to be able to make that real and be able to make sense of that And for it to feel like it's something that, can be navigated, overcome, be inspired by, One of the first steps is just to be able to get out of our own head and just ask, what's the worst that can happen?

Sarah Broadhead [00:40:55]:

Yeah. And and being comfortable Asking for help or talking to people or finding mentors or that is just so powerful. Like, we we're not designed to do things by ourselves. We're we're not the space to Have support from other people.

James Glover [00:41:09]:

Amazing. What a way to what a way to close down our conversation. Thank you, Sarah. Amazing to have you with us. Really appreciate you taking the time.

Sarah Broadhead [00:41:19]:

I've lost it. Thank you. Really, really good.

James Glover [00:41:24]:

Massive thank you for taking the time to listen to the Excitable Soul podcast. If you are interested in Uncovering, understanding, and unleashing your sense of purpose. Come and explore our purpose immersion programs at the excitable soul.com. We look forward to hearing from you there or being with you on our next episode. Have an incredible day.